www.sefindia.org

STRUCTURAL ENGINEERING FORUM OF INDIA [SEFI]

 Forum SubscriptionsSubscriptions DigestDigest Preferences   FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister FAQSecurity Tips FAQDonate
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log in to websiteLog in to websiteLog in to websiteLog in to forum 
Warning: Make sure you scan the downloaded attachment with updated antivirus tools  before opening them. They may contain viruses.
Use online scanners
here and here to upload downloaded attachment to check for safety.

National Test in Structural Engineering....

 
This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    www.sefindia.org Forum Index -> Past Discussions Year 2004
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
skjain.iitk
General Sponsor
General Sponsor


Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 104

PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 5:50 pm    Post subject: National Test in Structural Engineering.... Reply with quote

Dear Colleagues:
I am appending herewith a concept not for a National Test in Structural
Engineering that SEFI could conduct for B.E students at their early
third year. We request your impressions and feedback on the same. We
hope that a discussion on this may be useful to help improve it further.

thanking you and with best regards,

Sudhir Jain
IIT Kanpur


Concept Note for


National Test in Structural Engineering

* *

*Alpa Sheth and Sudhir K Jain*

* *

*Background: *

The structural engineering field in India is going through challenging
times. At one end there is a growing need for talented structural
engineers considering the frenzied pace of construction and
infrastructure development in the country. In spite of this need, the
field of civil engineering is unable to attract the best talent in the
student community due to myriad reasons: poor salaries due to poor
consulting fees, growing degradation of ethics in the civil engineering
community, low status of civil engineers in society and a general
perception of civil engineering being a traditional field without much
potential or apparent growth in the past few decades.

On the other hand there has been a mushrooming of engineering colleges
in the past few years. Some of the colleges are not even accredited and
do not have adequate facilities nor are able to attract good faculty.
Additionally, some of the existing institutions of repute in the past
are also going through a critical phase and their credibility and
standards stand greatly compromised due to paucity of good teaching
faculty, funds and other problems.

In the above scenario, the teaching of structural engineering has
suffered more than that of other disciplines of civil engineering due to
several reasons: (a) structural engineering is traditionally perceived
as the “toughest” subject within civil engineering and hence is the
first casualty when the students have low morale, (b) due to emphasis on
new and emerging disciplines within civil engineering such as
environmental engineering, transportation systems engineering,
geoinformatics (remote sensing, GIS, GPS, …), the number of courses
being taught in structural engineering has been shrinking with time.

As a result there is a general perception in the industry that the
students graduating from civil engineering colleges lack basic
analytical, computational or design skills. This was voiced in the first
e-conference held at NICEE on “Professional Issues in Structural
Engineering in India” (Aug 26-31 2002 www.nicee.org
<http://www.nicee.org/> ) and later in the SEFI e-Conference on
“Licensing Issues in Structural Engineering profession in the Indian
context” (March 24 - 28, 2003 www.sefindia.org <http://www.sefindia.org/> ).


*In view of the diverse quality of education and students, there
is a need to develop mechanisms which will contribute to improving
the quality of education by helping to:*


*a) motivate students and develop a passion for structural
engineering*


*b) encourage a healthy competition amongst the students and colleges*


c) benchmark the analytical and computational skills of students


d) Provide a tool for the practising community to identify
talented civil engineering students


Methodology

The Program consists of holding a National Test in August or September
of each year wherein third year civil engineering students across the
country can participate. The Test will evaluate their analytical skills
and conceptual understanding of behaviour of structures. It is assumed
that the students would have completed basic courses in solid mechanics,
structural analysis and engineering mathematics.

The Test will grade the students and give certificates and cash prizes
to the deserving candidates.

The Test will be conducted annually under the aegis of SEFI. SEFI will
set up a special committee for this project. The committee will a)
identify resource faculty to set the paper, b) identify participating
colleges and set up the logistics for conducting the Test in these
colleges. c) identify assessors to grade the papers.

The Test will be conducted through the participating engineering
colleges across the country. SEFI will partner with NICEE and IIT Kanpur
to identify the participating colleges, liaise with the colleges and
other issues. Local SEFI volunteers will assist in the logistics of
conducting the exams.

SEFI will also announce the results on its website. Whether the
certificate should be issued only by SEFI or by SEFI and NICEE/IITK
jointly, will be decided later depending on what will be better from the
view point of the prestige of the certificate.

*Budget*

SEFI is a voluntary organization and it may be possible for it to seek
the participation of faculty and members of SEFI without having to pay
honorarium (or, just notional honorarium, where needed) at least in the
first year.

However, funds will still be needed for preparation of question papers,
mailings, communications, grading of papers, certificates, etc. Also,
some payment may need to be made to the colleges hosting the examination
for miscellaneous costs associated with conducting the examination. A
cost of about Rs 100 per student may be assumed presently. In the
initial year, about 100 colleges may participate (as compared to more
than 300 colleges that have an undergraduate civil engineering
programme). It is estimated that on average about twenty students per
college would participate. Thus an annual budget of Rs 200,000/- (Rs Two
lakhs) is the minimum amount needed in the first instance. If it is
decided to proceed with _cash prizes_ (useful in the initial years at
least), a suitable additional amount will be needed.

After gaining experience the first time, it will be possible to better
estimate the costs associated with the programme. Going by other
experiences of IITK in conducting the undergraduate summer camp and the
workshops for master’s students, the number of colleges and the
interested students will grow every year.

/It may be mentioned that as a policy, we must not charge the students
any fees for appearing in the Test. Hence, the entire amount should be
raised from the industry./

*Benefits *

1. The Test will communicate to the students that they are wanted by
the structural engineering profession, thereby improving an
overall attitude towards the subject in the colleges.

2. The Test will help identify early enough (beginning third year)
students with aptitude for structural engineering. This will
motivate them to do better in structural engineering courses
during remaining tenure.

3. Colleges will take pride on success of the students and will pay
more attention to teaching of the subject.

4. The certificate will be passport to the students for seeking a job
in structural engineering profession.

5. Engineering firms will be able to use the certificate as a
preliminary screening mechanism for recruitment of engineers.

6. It will be possible to identify colleges that are consistently
doing a better job of teaching structural engineering. It will
also give a warning signal to the colleges from where the students
are not doing too well.

Posted via Email
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
gayatriajit
SEFI Member
SEFI Member


Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 10:33 pm    Post subject: National Test in Structural Engineering.... Reply with quote

Respected Sir,
I think this idea of having the test for BE students after they finish their second year is a very good idea. A lot of students at that phase are undecided as to which field of Civil Engineering they are going to persue. This will be helpful to them with respect to that as well.
Since students go for practical training after their third year most of the time, and as you said the results will be posted in the website, it will be of use both for the student as well as the hiring firm.

Regards
Gayatri

skjain@iitk.ac.in wrote:
Dear Colleagues:
I am appending herewith a concept not for a National Test in Structural
Engineering that SEFI could conduct for B.E students at their early
third year. We request your impressions and feedback on the same. We
hope that a discussion on this may be useful to help improve it further.

thanking you and with best regards,

Sudhir Jain
IIT Kanpur


Concept Note for


National Test in Structural Engineering

* *

*Alpa Sheth and Sudhir K Jain*

* *

*Background: *

The structural engineering field in India is going through challenging
times. At one end there is a growing need for talented structural
engineers considering the frenzied pace of construction and
infrastructure development in the country. In spite of this need, the
field of civil engineering is unable to attract the best talent in the
student community due to myriad reasons: poor salaries due to poor
consulting fees, growing degradation of ethics in the civil engineering
community, low status of civil engineers in society and a general
perception of civil engineering being a traditional field without much
potential or apparent growth in the past few decades.

On the other hand there has been a mushrooming of engineering colleges
in the past few years. Some of the colleges are not even accredited and
do not have adequate facilities nor are able to attract good faculty.
Additionally, some of the existing institutions of repute in the past
are also going through a critical phase and their credibility and
standards stand greatly compromised due to paucity of good teaching
faculty, funds and other problems.

In the above scenario, the teaching of structural engineering has
suffered more than that of other disciplines of civil engineering due to
several reasons: (a) structural engineering is traditionally perceived
as the “toughest” subject within civil engineering and hence is the
first casualty when the students have low morale, (b) due to emphasis on
new and emerging disciplines within civil engineering such as
environmental engineering, transportation systems engineering,
geoinformatics (remote sensing, GIS, GPS, …), the number of courses
being taught in structural engineering has been shrinking with time.

As a result there is a general perception in the industry that the
students graduating from civil engineering colleges lack basic
analytical, computational or design skills. This was voiced in the first
e-conference held at NICEE on “Professional Issues in Structural
Engineering in India” (Aug 26-31 2002 www.nicee.org
) and later in the SEFI e-Conference on
“Licensing Issues in Structural Engineering profession in the Indian
context” (March 24 - 28, 2003 www.sefindia.org ).


*In view of the diverse quality of education and students, there
is a need to develop mechanisms which will contribute to improving
the quality of education by helping to:*


*a) motivate students and develop a passion for structural
engineering*


*b) encourage a healthy competition amongst the students and colleges*


c) benchmark the analytical and computational skills of students


d) Provide a tool for the practising community to identify
talented civil engineering students


Methodology

The Program consists of holding a National Test in August or September
of each year wherein third year civil engineering students across the
country can participate. The Test will evaluate their analytical skills
and conceptual understanding of behaviour of structures. It is assumed
that the students would have completed basic courses in solid mechanics,
structural analysis and engineering mathematics.

The Test will grade the students and give certificates and cash prizes
to the deserving candidates.

The Test will be conducted annually under the aegis of SEFI. SEFI will
set up a special committee for this project. The committee will a)
identify resource faculty to set the paper, b) identify participating
colleges and set up the logistics for conducting the Test in these
colleges. c) identify assessors to grade the papers.

The Test will be conducted through the participating engineering
colleges across the country. SEFI will partner with NICEE and IIT Kanpur
to identify the participating colleges, liaise with the colleges and
other issues. Local SEFI volunteers will assist in the logistics of
conducting the exams.

SEFI will also announce the results on its website. Whether the
certificate should be issued only by SEFI or by SEFI and NICEE/IITK
jointly, will be decided later depending on what will be better from the
view point of the prestige of the certificate.

*Budget*

SEFI is a voluntary organization and it may be possible for it to seek
the participation of faculty and members of SEFI without having to pay
honorarium (or, just notional honorarium, where needed) at least in the
first year.

However, funds will still be needed for preparation of question papers,
mailings, communications, grading of papers, certificates, etc. Also,
some payment may need to be made to the colleges hosting the examination
for miscellaneous costs associated with conducting the examination. A
cost of about Rs 100 per student may be assumed presently. In the
initial year, about 100 colleges may participate (as compared to more
than 300 colleges that have an undergraduate civil engineering
programme). It is estimated that on average about twenty students per
college would participate. Thus an annual budget of Rs 200,000/- (Rs Two
lakhs) is the minimum amount needed in the first instance. If it is
decided to proceed with _cash prizes_ (useful in the initial years at
least), a suitable additional amount will be needed.

After gaining experience the first time, it will be possible to better
estimate the costs associated with the programme. Going by other
experiences of IITK in conducting the undergraduate summer camp and the
workshops for master’s students, the number of colleges and the
interested students will grow every year.

/It may be mentioned that as a policy, we must not charge the students
any fees for appearing in the Test. Hence, the entire amount should be
raised from the industry./

*Benefits *

1. The Test will communicate to the students that they are wanted by
the structural engineering profession, thereby improving an
overall attitude towards the subject in the colleges.

2. The Test will help identify early enough (beginning third year)
students with aptitude for structural engineering. This will
motivate them to do better in structural engineering courses
during remaining tenure.

3. Colleges will take pride on success of the students and will pay
more attention to teaching of the subject.

4. The certificate will be passport to the students for seeking a job
in structural engineering profession.

5. Engineering firms will be able to use the certificate as a
preliminary screening mechanism for recruitment of engineers.

6. It will be possible to identify colleges that are consistently
doing a better job of teaching structural engineering. It will
also give a warning signal to the colleges from where the students
are not doing too well.








          
---------------------------------

Posted via Email
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
malayk at designexcel.com
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2004 10:14 am    Post subject: National Test in Structural Engineering.... Reply with quote

Dear Sir,
The idea of conducting National Test is indeed a good idea.
But our idea is to attract best talents from student community into the
field of civil engg. in professional lvl.
Conducting such tests will certainly enhance there knowledge and they might
develop good design skills , but how seriously will they take ? And if at
all they take it seriously , how can it be assured that the best talent will
join the civil engineering force ?

Honestly speaking , as we have already identified the main issue , that why
the top students are not opting for civil engineering profession. That's
mainly because Indian civil engineering companies can't give a better offer
to a fresh graduate as compared to other industry .. right ? Now some of us
will say  ... "No even in civil engineering , people are earning handsome
pay .. etc etc .. " .. yes i also agree there are some civil engineers who
are earning a very good package ... but then the number of such ppl is less
, whereas in other industry like software most of the people are earning a
better pay.

I am also from a so called reputed institute and I have seen and faced the
reality. In 1999 , my B-tech friends
who went to software companies got offer from 1.5 lacs to 2.6 lacs per
annum ... and very few B-techs who opted for core civil (design) engineering
companies got offer upto 1.0 lac/annum. And not to talk about other
institutes , where even now a lso in 2004 a  civil engineering graduate is
offered just a mere of Rs 3000 per month. It's really sad , but true.

Luckily I had a very good boss/guide/teacher at my earlier workplace , who
inspired me who taught me .. who honoured me and showed me the right path
for a better life. Today I am practicing design engineering , not because I
used to like this subject from my college days , but because I had been
taught to love the work what I do by a very good Guide .


Regards
Malay

Posted via Email
Back to top
p_kadam
...
...


Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 165

PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 10:26 am    Post subject: National Test in Structural Engineering.... Reply with quote

Dear Friends,

1.It is difficult to find proper timing for the TEST during under grad years.There is a lot to learn in the struct engg syllabus in third &amp; fourth year.Could GATE not serve the purpose by splitting its results into different specialisations including structures (way it is done in Management entrance exams).

2.Evening postgraduate courses should be encouraged.

regards,

Posted via Email
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bksoneji
SEFI Member
SEFI Member


Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:39 pm    Post subject: National Test in Structural Engineering.... Reply with quote

Respected Sir,

The idea of conducting National Test in Structural Engineering is really exciting. It can create overall motivating environment for the students as well as for the faculties. But, because of low salary and low demand; the students are moving away from the “core” area. They are developing skills in IT and software like areas. I think these two things, ‘salary’ and ‘demand’ greatly control the interest of students in a particular field.



With best regards

B B Soneji


skjain@iitk.ac.in wrote:
Dear Colleagues:
I am appending herewith a concept not for a National Test in Structural
Engineering that SEFI could conduct for B.E students at their early
third year. We request your impressions and feedback on the same. We
hope that a discussion on this may be useful to help improve it further.

thanking you and with best regards,

Sudhir Jain
IIT Kanpur


Concept Note for


National Test in Structural Engineering

* *

*Alpa Sheth and Sudhir K Jain*

* *

*Background: *

The structural engineering field in India is going through challenging
times. At one end there is a growing need for talented structural
engineers considering the frenzied pace of construction and
infrastructure development in the country. In spite of this need, the
field of civil engineering is unable to attract the best talent in the
student community due to myriad reasons: poor salaries due to poor
consulting fees, growing degradation of ethics in the civil engineering
community, low status of civil engineers in society and a general
perception of civil engineering being a traditional field without much
potential or apparent growth in the past few decades.

On the other hand there has been a mushrooming of engineering colleges
in the past few years. Some of the colleges are not even accredited and
do not have adequate facilities nor are able to attract good faculty.
Additionally, some of the existing institutions of repute in the past
are also going through a critical phase and their credibility and
standards stand greatly compromised due to paucity of good teaching
faculty, funds and other problems.

In the above scenario, the teaching of structural engineering has
suffered more than that of other disciplines of civil engineering due to
several reasons: (a) structural engineering is traditionally perceived
as the “toughest” subject within civil engineering and hence is the
first casualty when the students have low morale, (b) due to emphasis on
new and emerging disciplines within civil engineering such as
environmental engineering, transportation systems engineering,
geoinformatics (remote sensing, GIS, GPS, …), the number of courses
being taught in structural engineering has been shrinking with time.

As a result there is a general perception in the industry that the
students graduating from civil engineering colleges lack basic
analytical, computational or design skills. This was voiced in the first
e-conference held at NICEE on “Professional Issues in Structural
Engineering in India” (Aug 26-31 2002 www.nicee.org
) and later in the SEFI e-Conference on
“Licensing Issues in Structural Engineering profession in the Indian
context” (March 24 - 28, 2003 www.sefindia.org ).


*In view of the diverse quality of education and students, there
is a need to develop mechanisms which will contribute to improving
the quality of education by helping to:*


*a) motivate students and develop a passion for structural
engineering*


*b) encourage a healthy competition amongst the students and colleges*


c) benchmark the analytical and computational skills of students


d) Provide a tool for the practising community to identify
talented civil engineering students


Methodology

The Program consists of holding a National Test in August or September
of each year wherein third year civil engineering students across the
country can participate. The Test will evaluate their analytical skills
and conceptual understanding of behaviour of structures. It is assumed
that the students would have completed basic courses in solid mechanics,
structural analysis and engineering mathematics.

The Test will grade the students and give certificates and cash prizes
to the deserving candidates.

The Test will be conducted annually under the aegis of SEFI. SEFI will
set up a special committee for this project. The committee will a)
identify resource faculty to set the paper, b) identify participating
colleges and set up the logistics for conducting the Test in these
colleges. c) identify assessors to grade the papers.

The Test will be conducted through the participating engineering
colleges across the country. SEFI will partner with NICEE and IIT Kanpur
to identify the participating colleges, liaise with the colleges and
other issues. Local SEFI volunteers will assist in the logistics of
conducting the exams.

SEFI will also announce the results on its website. Whether the
certificate should be issued only by SEFI or by SEFI and NICEE/IITK
jointly, will be decided later depending on what will be better from the
view point of the prestige of the certificate.

*Budget*

SEFI is a voluntary organization and it may be possible for it to seek
the participation of faculty and members of SEFI without having to pay
honorarium (or, just notional honorarium, where needed) at least in the
first year.

However, funds will still be needed for preparation of question papers,
mailings, communications, grading of papers, certificates, etc. Also,
some payment may need to be made to the colleges hosting the examination
for miscellaneous costs associated with conducting the examination. A
cost of about Rs 100 per student may be assumed presently. In the
initial year, about 100 colleges may participate (as compared to more
than 300 colleges that have an undergraduate civil engineering
programme). It is estimated that on average about twenty students per
college would participate. Thus an annual budget of Rs 200,000/- (Rs Two
lakhs) is the minimum amount needed in the first instance. If it is
decided to proceed with _cash prizes_ (useful in the initial years at
least), a suitable additional amount will be needed.

After gaining experience the first time, it will be possible to better
estimate the costs associated with the programme. Going by other
experiences of IITK in conducting the undergraduate summer camp and the
workshops for master’s students, the number of colleges and the
interested students will grow every year.

/It may be mentioned that as a policy, we must not charge the students
any fees for appearing in the Test. Hence, the entire amount should be
raised from the industry./

*Benefits *

1. The Test will communicate to the students that they are wanted by
the structural engineering profession, thereby improving an
overall attitude towards the subject in the colleges.

2. The Test will help identify early enough (beginning third year)
students with aptitude for structural engineering. This will
motivate them to do better in structural engineering courses
during remaining tenure.

3. Colleges will take pride on success of the students and will pay
more attention to teaching of the subject.

4. The certificate will be passport to the students for seeking a job
in structural engineering profession.

5. Engineering firms will be able to use the certificate as a
preliminary screening mechanism for recruitment of engineers.

6. It will be possible to identify colleges that are consistently
doing a better job of teaching structural engineering. It will
also give a warning signal to the colleges from where the students
are not doing too well.

Posted via Email
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
This forum is locked: you cannot post, reply to, or edit topics.This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    www.sefindia.org Forum Index -> Past Discussions Year 2004 All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


© 2003, 2008 SEFINDIA, Indian Domain Registration
Publishing or acceptance of an advertisement is neither a guarantee nor endorsement of the advertiser's product or service. advertisement policy